The Snow Tire FAQ Forums
The Snow Tire FAQ
     
Home • Snow Tire FAQ • Forum • Recommended • Reviews • Snow Tire Tests • Forum Portal • Tools & References • Where to Buy
Check your PM • Register • Log in
 
A place to discuss Snow Tires and Winter Driving.
Calendar 
         
Snow Tire FAQ Search


Add to Google



Advanced Forum Search

Current Test Conditions
Find more about Weather in Fairport, NY
Click for weather forecast

Google's Suggestions

Board Navigation
Home
Forum

Acronyms
Album
Calendar
Downloads
Forum Tour
Knowledge Base
Latest Ratings
Links
Online Users
Personal Albums
RSS Feed
Rules
Staff
Statistics

FAQ
Search Forums
Search Downloads
Search KB

My Cookies

Poll
How do you like the new look of Snow Tire FAQ?
  It's GREAT!
  It's OKAY, but...
  I like the old look better.
  Is that the best you could do?
  Who cares, I just want to get at the information.
You must login to vote

Donations
New Donations
1  Donated by:   Londoner43
Amount:5
2  Donated by:   Anonymous
Amount:1
3  Donated by:   mstrmstr
Amount:5
4  Donated by:   Anonymous
Amount:5
5  Donated by:   Anonymous
Amount:0

Make A Donation

Studded tire controversy?!
 
View previous topic View printer-friendly version Search Display number of posts for each poster in this topic Export topic thread to a text file View next topic
Author Message
Mario Germain
Frequent Contributor
Frequent Contributor
2 Points

PostYou have posted in this forum: Mon Jan 10, 2005 11:08 pm   Post subject:  Studded tire controversy?! Back to top 

While searching on the net tonight, I found this document about a "studded tire controversy".

It containt useful statistic and a bit of data about studded tires. Is it 100% true? Maybe but it's quite clear that the author is biaised toward the use of studded tires, so....

http://insuite.net/uploads/24/documents/Documents/Cover%20Page.PDF

_________________
Talon Tsi AWD 90 (rally car)
Galant VR-4 92 (summer/drag racing car)
Honda Civic 2005 (family car)
GMC Sierra 1500 4x4
Download Post  No rating  
Mario Germain
Frequent Contributor
Frequent Contributor
2 Points

PostYou have posted in this forum: Mon Jan 10, 2005 11:51 pm   Post subject:   Back to top 

Another study with a lot more data on the studded/studless debate.

http://www.wsdot.wa.gov/winter/studtire/Studded_Tire_Report_Final_Nov_2002.pdf

_________________
Talon Tsi AWD 90 (rally car)
Galant VR-4 92 (summer/drag racing car)
Honda Civic 2005 (family car)
GMC Sierra 1500 4x4
Download Post  No rating  
Mario Germain
Frequent Contributor
Frequent Contributor
2 Points

PostYou have posted in this forum: Tue Jan 11, 2005 12:15 am   Post subject:   Back to top 

Wow! This is the kind of test that I wanted to do for a while but someone actually did it! Very Happy

http://ffden-2.phys.uaf.edu/211.fall2000.web.projects/woodrow%20dau%20templeton/Data.htm

This is a method for testing snow tire traction without using a car. I posted it here because this study is comparing different type of tires (studless, studded, summer, ...) but maybe the lather part of the post could be relocated in another section since it's not really "reviews" but discussion about testing methods... Question

Since the same method could be used to compare different model of winter tires. I'm now thinking about a way to compare tires without cutting them apart like this... Idea

Now I really need to go to sleep... Wink

_________________
Talon Tsi AWD 90 (rally car)
Galant VR-4 92 (summer/drag racing car)
Honda Civic 2005 (family car)
GMC Sierra 1500 4x4
Download Post  No rating  
jwernerny
Site Admin
Site Admin
3123 Points

USA US New York
PostYou have posted in this forum: Tue Jan 11, 2005 10:21 am   Post subject:  More reports & Data Back to top 

I perused the articles and found them interestingly biased.

To add more fire to the issue: Ice racers always find studs are faster then studless. The ice for these races is far from a hockey rink surface. Usually, it looks more like chewed up dirt that is made of ice instead of dirt.

As a final thought, take a look at the results of the Norweigan Tire Tests found in another thread.


My choice: When I am rallying, I want studs. For normal driving around here (Rochester, NY), I don't run studs.

[BTW: I think we can leave this thread here for the time being. I think it is close enough to revews that it doesn't need to be moved.]

_________________
John Werner - Driving Innovative, Out of the Box Solutions
Editor: The Snow Tire FAQ (http://www.snowtire.info)
Download Post  No rating  
Mario Germain
Frequent Contributor
Frequent Contributor
2 Points

PostYou have posted in this forum: Fri Jan 21, 2005 11:38 pm   Post subject:   Back to top 

Here is a couple more articles about studded tires. The first one is quite a big study about winter tire usage in Alaska.

http://www.engr.uaa.alaska.edu/soe/Research/Docs/Studded%20Tires%20in%20Alaska.pdf

http://www.usroads.com/journals/aruj/9712/ru971202.htm

http://www.usroads.com/journals/p/rilj/9809/ri980904.htm

Enough info for me now, next thing is to try them! Very Happy It's been very cold here during the last two weeks so I wish my studded tire we're ready. I want to try them in these temperature where the friction tire are harder and have less traction).

_________________
Talon Tsi AWD 90 (rally car)
Galant VR-4 92 (summer/drag racing car)
Honda Civic 2005 (family car)
GMC Sierra 1500 4x4
Download Post  No rating  
Quattrofan
Real User
Real User
0 Points

PostYou have posted in this forum: Tue Feb 08, 2005 5:52 pm   Post subject:   Back to top 

This has been a major controversy in Washington State, and the biggest problem IMHO is that the majority of people don't know about modern alternatives and the local tire dealers still pawn studded tires like it was crack!

I live in Seattle (very mild climate) and I'd say near 20% of the population runs studs, ALL winter long! It's totally absurd and just tears up the roads.

The Washington State DOT has been trying to get them banned for years, but they run up against vigilanties from Eastern WA who will be buried with thier studs (as well as thier guns, lotto tickets, and choice bottle of hard alcohol), and special interest groups ranging from road construction contractors to the local tire dealer association. It gets shot down every time due to these special interests, vs. the greater good of everyone.

I've been trying to do what I can to raise awareness about moden snow tire technology and road friendly alternatives.

Any comments welcome.

_________________
Dan Hussey
Seattle, WA
'04 Volvo V70R
Many past Quattros
Download Post  No rating  
jwernerny
Site Admin
Site Admin
3123 Points

USA US New York
PostYou have posted in this forum: Tue Feb 08, 2005 6:08 pm   Post subject:   Back to top 

For people who only drive on roads completely clear of ice and packed snow, studs will not help. If you spend time where the roads are ice and snow-packed, even the best of the friction tires don't compete with studs. (I have driven the best of the friction tires out there, and when it is really bad, give me the studs.)

If you read the articles from Finland and Alaska, you will find that while the savings in road maintenance costs was offset by the increased costs from more MVAs.

_________________
John Werner - Driving Innovative, Out of the Box Solutions
Editor: The Snow Tire FAQ (http://www.snowtire.info)
Download Post  No rating  
RickGTX
Frequent Contributor
Frequent Contributor
57 Points

USA US New York
PostYou have posted in this forum: Mon Oct 23, 2006 11:35 am   Post subject:   Back to top 

John, would you still stick with studs if the car was 4WD? I've been running in the same class as you in the winter series events since about '99, in both a couple of Mazda 323GTXs and a Ford Ranger.

I've always run Blizzaks (well, Winter Duelers on the truck) and have so far had good luck. The GTX is now almost primarily a winter TSD car and studs are no longer off-the-table for me, so I'm reevaluating what I want/need in a snow tire for it.

_________________
Rick Barnes

1988 Mazda 323GTX
Download Post  No rating  
jwernerny
Site Admin
Site Admin
3123 Points

USA US New York
PostYou have posted in this forum: Mon Oct 23, 2006 8:32 pm   Post subject:  Re: Studded tire controversy?! Back to top 

If we have a real winter for the Winter Rally Challenge Series, and it actually is snowing and there is snow on the road, I would probably run a set of studded tires.

If the roads are going to be mostly dry, don't run studs, they just slow you down in corners and you will end up trashing them after the winter.

So, my best, cost-no-limit option: 1 set of studded tires (Nokian Hakka 4) and one set of high speed studless winter tires (Hakka WR, Vredestein SnowTrac 2, Green Diamond Icelanders).

- John

_________________
John Werner - Driving Innovative, Out of the Box Solutions
Editor: The Snow Tire FAQ (http://www.snowtire.info)
Download Post  No rating  
RickGTX
Frequent Contributor
Frequent Contributor
57 Points

USA US New York
PostYou have posted in this forum: Tue Oct 24, 2006 8:56 am   Post subject:   Back to top 

Well, that had been my plan. I have plenty of wheels, but this year I've only got the budget for one set of tires. We know that we'll have fairly dry rallies and we'll have events that surprise us with snow. So maybe the RSi?

_________________
Rick Barnes

1988 Mazda 323GTX
Download Post  No rating  
jwernerny
Site Admin
Site Admin
3123 Points

USA US New York
PostYou have posted in this forum: Tue Oct 24, 2006 1:22 pm   Post subject:  Re: Studded tire controversy?! Back to top 

The RSi is probably a good choice. I haven't tested a set on a rally, but I might do that this winter myself.

BTW, There should be an update on the RSi's in the Real World Snow Tire Tests posted very soon now.

- John

_________________
John Werner - Driving Innovative, Out of the Box Solutions
Editor: The Snow Tire FAQ (http://www.snowtire.info)
Download Post  No rating  
Display posts from previous:      
 


 Jump to:   



  View previous topic View printer-friendly version Search Display number of posts for each poster in this topic Export topic thread to a text file View next topic

You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum

Warning: file(./ctracker/logfiles/logfile_worms.txt): failed to open stream: Permission denied in /homepages/21/d217835057/htdocs/SnowTire/forum/ctracker/classes/class_log_manager.php on line 235

Lo-Fi Version
Board Security
23459 Attacks blocked
Protected by phpBB Security phpBB-Amod :: phpBB Security ©  Has Blocked 96 Exploit Attempts.
 @ 2007 The Integra Team
 @ 2007 phpBB Group
:: FI Theme :: All times are GMT ::
[Page generation time: 0.1346s (PHP: 66% | SQL: 34%) | SQL queries: 76 | GZIP disabled | Debug off]